Kat (00:01.501)
Hey Tiff. I know we're just, yeah, I'm kind of ready to stare off into space tonight. So this might be a fun one. How are you?

Tiffany / Greening Up My Act (00:03.054)
Hi, just staring into the screen. Alright, I'm super tired. I don't know if this is still like leftover from my sickness or what, but I just yeah, I'm trying to become a tea person and I don't know if there's like a transition. I did have coffee today, but I only had one cup. So maybe that's why.

Kat (00:18.259)
Being sick. I feel you. Your body's weaning itself off the drug. I will say in two weeks I plan to do the Joy of Coffee, so we can discuss that.

Greening Up My Act (00:35.073)
Yeah. Okay, then we should do the Joy of Tea. Just kidding. No, I did, I went to a really, really cool tea tasting. It was my friend's baby shower that I planned and I was sort of like hoping that it would go well and then it went really well. I'd never done it before, but it was like, yeah, it was so cool. So that was the highlight.

Kat (00:42.099)
That's awesome. Okay, we'll go into detail on that in four weeks when we do the Joy of Tea. I'm into it. But for tonight, it's something I guess kind of pseudo related to tea. There's a certain romance about long walks. 

Like we think of wandering the moors in a gothic novel or like pondering your life on the cliffs of the sea while you walk or like every Jane Austen heroine or Anne of Green Gables, they all just go for walks. It's like a very romantic thing to do. you know, mostly for the most part is because they didn't have cars. 

So the only way they could get anywhere was to either saddle up a horse, get a cart or walk. but it's, I mean, there's also, they talk about the romance of it in, in the novels, you know, that I must, I must walk to clear my head. must. So, but today, if you're on TikTok, which I'm not, I don't think you are either, but, have you heard of, have you heard of the new romantic term for walking? It's a fart walk.

Greening Up My Act (02:07.447)
No.

Kat (02:11.123)
So romantic. It means going on a walk right after eating to help relieve gas.

Greening Up My Act (02:11.279)
Oh funny, so you don't have to like fart in a room with other people around? That's funny. Or just digestion.

Kat (02:17.619)
It's catchy? Yeah. Yeah. Well, there's... It's a cute term, you know, let's go for our fart rock, you know, but is it more than just a catchy fad? Is walking good for you? So let's take a walk and find out. 

Welcome to Greening Up My Act.

Greening Up My Act (02:38.634)
Alright.

Kat (02:59.429)
Awesome. Yeah. the fart walk thing, Sean, I, I'd heard about it. It apparently took off on TikTok kind of recently, but Sean sent me, he's like, have you heard of this? And I was like, yeah, I've heard of it. But like the New York times did an article on it and stuff. It's like fart, fart walk is the new TikTok trend that everybody's talking about. And, but there's some, you know, questions about it, scientific veracity. I'm going to, yeah, I'm going to get into it.

Greening Up My Act (03:18.872)
So funny.

Kat (03:28.367)
My sources this week, I had Harvard had five surprising benefits of walking. Health line, fart walking may promote digestive health and lower diabetes risk. NBC News had why walking is the most underrated form of exercise. Health line, another article from them is which is better for your health, walking or running. The New York Times had running versus walking, which is better for lasting health. And then Science Direct had city walk or nature walk.

Greening Up My Act (03:46.697)
Mmm.

Kat (03:55.636)
So what's so great about walks? I mean, I'm sure you enjoy walking. I enjoy walking.

Greening Up My Act (04:03.638)
Yes. It's the thing I miss most about where I live right now, because I've only lived somewhere walkable since college. And this is the first time I can't walk anywhere without death probably coming shortly after.

Kat (04:20.241)
Yeah, yeah, you've said your road is not exactly, there's no shoulder, there's no sidewalk, there's...

Greening Up My Act (04:26.318)
No shoulder, people drive like 60 miles an hour. It's a 35 mile per hour road, but people fly. So, um, yeah, I love taking walks. I used to walk all the time, all the time.

Kat (04:31.792)
Yeah.

Kat (04:38.099)
Yeah, I remember in college, my doctor was like, do you exercise? And I was like, well, I walk. She's like, everyone walks in college. And I was like, I walk a lot more than that. You know, I was like.

Greening Up My Act (04:53.398)
Also, like, that doesn't mean just because everyone else is doing it that it doesn't count as exercise. That's stupid. Okay.

Kat (04:57.585)
I know, yeah, so, yeah. But, okay, so I...

Greening Up My Act (05:04.022)
It's like saying I run, but so does everybody else. Okay. And anyway.

Kat (05:06.565)
Yeah, yeah, we're, yeah, we're at a running school, I guess everyone runs, I don't know. But yeah, I don't know. But I, you know, to get down to like we were just saying any physical activity is good for you. Any. But walking is kind of underrated. It has been proven to improve cardiac health, alleviate depression, improve your mood...

Greening Up My Act (05:12.13)
Yeah. Okay.

Kat (05:31.015)
...prevent weight gain, reduce the risk cancer, improve endurance of circulation, improve posture. It's just good for you.

Greening Up My Act (05:38.712)
Cancer is shocking.

Kat (05:39.941)
Yeah, I don't know about the mechanisms from that. think some of these studies just say that it does. They don't say how. Bless you. Look at you muting. Yeah, that was stellar. If you're not watching on YouTube, she just sneezed stealthily in the background. But okay, there is some scientific evidence that it can improve your digestion. So no one has officially studied fart walks specifically, weirdly.

Greening Up My Act (05:46.491)
Thank you. Got it just in time. I wish that there was like a thesis that was titled Fart Walk.

Kat (06:09.907)
I'm sure Gen Z is coming up with it. I'm sure there'll be a Gen Z fart walk. Research has shown light to moderate movement after eating is good for your gut.

Greening Up My Act (06:19.018)
Yeah, I mean that makes... it's logical.

Kat (06:20.263)
Yeah. So one study found that walking within 10 minutes after meals lowered blood sugar, excuse me, in people with type two diabetes, more than 30 minutes of walking not associated with meals. So just a 10 minute walk after eating was better than a sustained 30 minute walk throughout the day for lowering blood sugar levels. It also stimulates peristalsis to walk. That's the process by which food moves through your gut. It brings blood...

Greening Up My Act (06:34.248)
Interesting.

Kat (06:50.363)
...into your bowels and makes motility happen, which is motility is stuff moving through your guts. So it does stimulate digestion. It helps. It may relieve heartburn. They found some studies that say it may relieve heartburn to walk after eating. Also, by the way, yoga can do this, but fart yoga doesn't sound as cool as a fart walk and also less pleasant. feel like, like there's something about going outside and releasing your noxious gases into the wilderness.

Greening Up My Act (07:15.201)
Yeah, totally.

Kat (07:20.977)
So that article in Harvard had five surprising benefits of walking. So reduces the effects of obesity promoting genes, which it didn't go into any of these studies in depth. So obesity promoting genes, I guess, is the things you're born with that make you more prone towards gaining weight. Obesity is its own can of worms. I don't really believe in it as a...

Kat (07:48.775)
Diagnosis, there's other things about being overweight that are worse for you than being overweight, which is mostly stress and stigma around being overweight. But just being overweight is not a health indicator on its own for the most part. Most doctors, I think, agree. But it reduced the effects of these obesity promoting genes by about half if you walk for about an hour a day.

Greening Up My Act (07:55.148)
Yeah. Right. yep. That makes sense.

Kat (08:13.679)
Helps you cut backs on sweet cravings. Even just a 15 minute walk curbs your cravings for other sugary snacks according to one or chocolate even According or stress eating chocolate, which I think is another obesity promoting gene issue is the desire to stress eat Cuts your risk of developing breast cancer. So this study was interesting women who walked seven or more hours a week. So that's an hour a day plus had a 14 % lower risk of breast cancer according to the American Cancer Society study. I don't know why. It might be because it alleviates stress.

Greening Up My Act (08:44.376)
Huh. Yeah. Or just like, if you're walking that much, you're probably exercising in other ways too. And exercise in general maybe helps. I don't know.

Kat (08:57.575)
Maybe. I mean, an hour a day plus gym time sounds like a lot to me, but...

Greening Up My Act (09:03.232)
Yeah, but I'm thinking if you're like walking your dog twice a day or something.

Kat (09:05.959)
Yeah, maybe that's possible. Yeah, it didn't really go into the whys of all this, but it also walking eases arthritis related joint pain because walking lubricates and protects the joints and strengthens the muscles that support them. So that makes sense.

Kat (09:24.691)
Okay. And then it also boosts your immunity. So this is another study that they didn't explain the why of it, but people who walked at least 20 minutes a day, five days a week had 43 % fewer sick days than people who didn't walk. They were also sicker for shorter periods when they did get sick and they had milder symptoms. So again, this could all be related to stress relief, but, and that's the next part of this is walking does things to your brain. Like

Greening Up My Act (09:42.624)
Okay, interesting.

Greening Up My Act (09:48.066)
Yeah.

Kat (09:53.467)
alleviates stress and depression. So it also makes you more creative. A study from Stanford University found that walking increased creative output by an average of 60%. Yeah. So, yeah.

Greening Up My Act (10:06.606)
Whoa, that's walking or just being outside.

Kat (10:11.552)
No, walking specifically. Excuse me, I got a frog in my throat.

Greening Up My Act (10:13.898)
Okay, I'm assuming that has probably has to be outside.

Kat (10:19.473)
Well, they said that it, because it creates the ability to divergent thinking, they called it, which is a thought process used to generate creative ideas by exploring many possible solutions. So it enhances that. And they, they didn't say if it was outside or not. I would think so.

Greening Up My Act (10:43.18)
Yeah, but I mean, I guess maybe if you sort of like giving yourself time to think if you're even on a treadmill.

Kat (10:48.751)
Yeah, well, because it's harder to like type or sit at a screen, you know, they said, according to study walking opens up the free flow of ideas and it is a simple and robust solution to the goal of increasing creativity and increasing physical activity. So I would assume it's to like leave your desk and go for a walk. You know, they do say that breaks. We need breaks in our brains need breaks. but yeah, I would.

Greening Up My Act (10:52.824)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Kat (11:17.733)
They didn't say whether that was walking outside or not in that study. but another study found that it's a proven mood boost booster. just 10 minutes or excuse me, 12 minutes of walking resulted in an increase in joviality, vigor, attentiveness, and self-confidence versus the same time spent sitting again. didn't. Yeah. Well, yeah. I think it's just moving your body around gets you because when you sit, you're just.

Greening Up My Act (11:37.343)
I totally believe it.

Kat (11:46.513)
Your brain is just all up in here. Walking, you have to engage actively. you're, it's not an autonomic, autonomic nervous process, nervous system process, right? Like breathing you do, whether you're conscious of it or not. Walking, you have to be at least semi-conscious of doing it. Again, it's a repetitive motion. So it's not like you're like, put the foot in front of the other and bend the knee, but you do have to consciously engage your brain in some way to walk.

And so it removes just the rumination stuff. That's my theory about it. But yeah, those are, there are any, if you look up the benefits of walking, there's just hundreds of them. Yeah. and you know, you can say from personal experience, it just makes you feel better, you know? Now, something I had heard was a rumor that I was like,

Greening Up My Act (12:16.461)
Yeah. That's so awesome.

Kat (12:45.307)
Is walking better than running? That's a big question that people have. So the answer is probably no. Sorry. according to New York times, running is better for you in the long run for several reasons. First of all, it improves your VO, a long run, it improves your VO two max, which is the measure of how much oxygen your body uses when you're exercising vigorously. This is something that most fitness like...

Greening Up My Act (12:54.093)
Okay.

Kat (13:13.959)
... wearables measure, and it declines as you get older. But the higher you can have it, the better you are at using oxygen, basically. And it predicts your lifespan. Like the better your VO2 max, the longer you're likely to live.

Greening Up My Act (13:23.522)
Okay. That's crazy.

Kat (13:32.945)
So yeah, obviously walking at all is better than being sedentary for improving your VO2 max, but the faster you can walk or run, the better your VO2 max will be. And they say moving from light to moderate activity strengthens your heart and creates new mitochondria, the powerhouse of the cell. So yeah, but the, the deal is that running is just more efficient for improving your health than brisk walking. you burn twice as many calories when you run as when you walk.

Greening Up My Act (13:51.764)
Wow. Okay.

Kat (14:03.539)
And according to this Times article, you'd need to walk 105 minutes to achieve the same lower risk of dying as going for a 25 minute run. So that lowers your risk of dying by 35%, by the way. More than a third.

Greening Up My Act (14:11.834)
Dang. Dang. And that's like daily or what?

Kat (14:20.301)
Just in general, like I, I, it should be daily. would think at, or at least three times a week or something.

Greening Up My Act (14:27.47)
It's not like I ran once 25 minutes and therefore I... Yeah.

Kat (14:31.451)
It lowered my risk by 35%. Yeah. I mean, that does seem kind of weird. yeah. Like, But I mean, a hundred, like, I guess that's like, if you think an hour long walk is 60 minutes. So 105 minute walk is an hour and 35 minutes. that's walking that much is, is, is a big time suck, you know? Yeah. and again,

Greening Up My Act (14:36.648)
It's probably every day or maybe a couple times a week. Yes, it's significantly longer for sure.

Kat (15:01.119)
The reason I thought that running was worse for you was because it's harder on your joints and stuff. And that that's been debunked. Apparently it's not. So runners are more likely to have short-term injuries like plantar fasciitis, joint injuries, connective tissue issues, but that's mostly if they overdo it. It's, it's, it actually doesn't bust your knees up or your hips. It actually strengthens them because

Greening Up My Act (15:06.826)
Yeah, that's what I was thinking.

Kat (15:30.511)
That high impact activity on your bones creates little fissures, which heal over, which strengthens your bones. And running or jogging is better for creating that than walking because it's a more high impact activity. So it's actually better for you to run for your joints. Now running, running wrong or too much, straining yourself. That's when those injuries come, but it doesn't actually damage your knees and stuff like people think it does.

Greening Up My Act (15:39.358)
Really? Whoa. That's crazy. Okay, because I trained for a half marathon and I trained pretty well. I I ran with a running group, but it was also the first time I had run that far and my knees were bruised the next day.

Kat (16:11.833)
Yikes. mean, and that I got shin splints, but that's again, it's from adding too much distance too quickly, going too fast, you know, not being careful about terrain. That's a, and a lot of people who are runners have this kind of competitive mindset and they'll overdo it, you know, especially if you're training, you're trying to get a really good time for your race. Yeah. You're, trying to get up to like a nine minute, eight minute, seven minute mile. You're probably going to push yourself further than your body really wants you to.

Greening Up My Act (16:17.812)
Yeah. 

Kat (16:42.181)
So that's the problem with running is people don't ease into it. But again, your news are fine now, right? Yeah. So, well, that's crazy. Yeah. I mean, you're in your feet. mean, there used to be this website I used to look at called Regretsy and it was, she was just making fun of really bad Etsy projects people did. And

Greening Up My Act (16:46.7)
Yeah. Yeah. They were just like black and blue. It was weird.

Kat (17:10.647)
One of the ones she made fun of was like somebody had made like running is sexy, like buttons or something. And she's like, yeah, sure. Running. she like took pictures from, you know, public media places and it's like people shit their pants, you know, and they run and their nipples are bleeding or, know, she's like, yeah, running is real. People are just throwing up. I think about that all the time. I'm like, running is sexy. If you'd like to shit your pants. Yeah.

Greening Up My Act (17:26.762)
Yes. People lose toenails. That's so funny.

Kat (17:41.021)
So it's just running is good for you. Like even short bursts of running during your walk can be good for you. you just even just do a five minute quicker pace, just a quick jog for five minutes during a 20 minute walk, you can improve your VO2 max. So you don't have to be like, well, I'm going to go run a 10K now next week. NBC News had a slightly different take about running versus walking.

Greening Up My Act (18:05.42)
Right.

Kat (18:10.641)
They said when comparing the results of the most recent national runners health study within the national walkers health study, researchers found that the energy used for moderate intensity walking and vigorous intensity running resulted in similar reductions in risk for high blood pressure, high cholesterol, diabetes, and heart disease over the study six year period. So it was moderate to vigorous intensity is what's good for you. The light stroll is not going to have the same effect.

Greening Up My Act (18:30.167)
Okay.

Kat (18:39.975)
... is what it comes down to. So basically exercise to your level of ability and challenge yourself, but don't overdo it. That's what they're saying.

Greening Up My Act (18:50.828)
Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah, that makes sense.

Kat (18:54.493)
Yeah. Okay. I think this is a good spot to take a wee break.

Greening Up My Act (18:56.61)
Very cool, a wee break.

Kat (19:17.331)
Alright, welcome back. Now this is where I might get little controversial. My question is, is it better to walk in nature?

Greening Up My Act (19:26.752)
Okay, I'm curious.

Kat (19:27.731)
Okay, so we talk all the time about how nature is good for you, especially on this podcast. We're very into nature. We talk, you know, forest bathing is a trend where you just go out into the woods. Do you, do you know like kind of the strictures of forest bathing?

Greening Up My Act (19:43.964)
I don't... I've heard it so many times and I'm like does that just mean sit in the woods like, I don't get it.

Kat (19:49.253)
Yeah, I think that's kind of the idea is just go be out in nature. I mean, there's a lot of benefits to nature, obviously.

Greening Up My Act (19:53.538)
Okay. It seems like an Instagram trend or TikTok trend for just like a thing people do.

Kat (19:59.379)
Yeah, well, I think it's actually like an old Japanese trend that people kind of caught on to But the idea is like or even in my it's probably Swedish. Everything good is Swedish, right? It's Higgy, but yeah, you go out on the woods where there's not any Civilization basically no sign of human ideally no sign of human anything and sit in the wilderness and just

Greening Up My Act (20:05.49)
Okay. Okay.

Kat (20:27.943)
Bathe in the forest and the oxygen from the trees is supposed to be good for you and the noises from the birds. mean, these are all things that our bodies have evolved to sync up with, you know? so I believe in the benefits of nature. but the benefits of walking in nature over city walking are kind of up for debate.

Greening Up My Act (20:52.32)
Okay, that's interesting. I just looked it up, forest bathing was developed in Japan in, says the 1980s. So not that long ago, but...

Kat (20:55.409)
Okay. There we go. wow. When, when giant cities were taking off and threatening our wellbeing. Yeah. Okay. That makes sense. Yeah. I mean, like you have to think about a hundred years ago, it was a lot easier to just be out in nature than it is now. Like most people, especially in the United States are city dwellers and we have to make an effort.

Greening Up My Act (21:04.587)
Yeah. Yeah.

Kat (21:24.701)
to get away from buildings and manicured lawns and, you know, nature doesn't really exist for us in a lot of ways. So this is a very new development in our evolution, you know, being apart from nature. But so the NBC News article that I read said that walking in nature specifically was found to reduce ruminating over negative experiences, which increases activity in the brain associated with negative emotions and raises the risk of depression.

Greening Up My Act (21:37.459)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Kat (21:54.397)
They didn't say why again, just that according to their study, that's what they found. But then that science direct article said a study from the WHO found that physical activities conducted in natural settings. So maybe more beneficial for promoting positive mental health outcomes. However, the study was inconclusive because it included jogging, walking and running. So they can't say for sure that nature was the defining factor because it was all.

Greening Up My Act (21:54.744)
Okay.

Kat (22:24.669)
different types of physical activity, not just walking, which is kind of like, get that they have to be very specific in science in saying that like, well, this is conclusive, but they're right. The studies themselves are not definitely conclusive that walking in nature is better for you. I would posit that walking in nature is better because again, it's less stressful. There's no cars, right? There's no distracting billboards. There's fewer

Greening Up My Act (22:27.286)
Right. Yep.

Kat (22:54.311)
people. Again, that sync with nature that we have that we've lost, you know, natural light. It smells better. There's no carfumes. There's no, you know, trash, ideally, you know, hopefully not other people blasting their stereos, you know, all of those things that can

Greening Up My Act (22:56.088)
Yeah. Yes, there's little animals and bugs and birds, yeah.

Kat (23:15.951)
Yeah, the distractions are less screen-based and more, you know, natural to our rhythms, our circadian rhythms. So that's why I would think that walking in nature would be better. but there's no conclusive science about it.

Greening Up My Act (23:36.436)
I have heard, and I don't remember exactly what the study said, but I've heard that comparing a walking or running on a treadmill to walking or running on a trail is what I remember, that the trail is always going to give you that mood boost because visually, humans need to see things passing by them. And so I kind of

Kat (23:59.919)
Yeah, you can't get that on the screen. Yeah.

Greening Up My Act (24:03.7)
Yeah, you can't get it on a screen, can't get it on a treadmill, and I kind of wonder if it matters so much if that stuff passing by is like buildings or trees, you know what I mean?

Kat (24:14.959)
Right. Yeah. I don't, I mean, I would say probably trees would be better for you, you know, or, mean, just like the stunning beauty of the natural wilderness in our, or not even wilderness, the paved trails in our national parks are just the natural beauty of it. Having that pass by you on a walk just feels so much better than...

Greening Up My Act (24:19.182)
I don't know. Probably.

Kat (24:44.999)
... running in New York or walking in New York, you...

Greening Up My Act (24:47.936)
It does. Yeah, I was thinking like, yeah, everywhere I enjoyed walking in DC was in the park. some bridges are nice, but it's not the same.

Kat (24:55.109)
Yep. Okay. There's something about natural vistas and I think it's, you know, and it could be a placebo effect, you know, that.

Greening Up My Act (25:07.808)
Yeah, although I will say actually, now that I'm thinking about it, sometimes it was really nice to walk in like Adams Morgan area or like places with a lot of little shops because I was feeling lonely and that just inherently made me feel less lonely. So that was really nice.

Kat (25:18.813)
Mm-hmm.

Kat (25:24.303)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. There's something to be said for that too. Just like a not too crowded Champs-Elysees, you know, in Paris. It's, it's cool to people watch too, you know. sorry, keep hitting this with my knee. Yeah. You're part of a community. Yeah. Even if you're not talking to anyone. You know, what did somebody, somebody posted on Instagram or X or whatever it's called now sometimes like...

Greening Up My Act (25:29.315)
Yeah, I just kind of feel like part of the community. 

Kat (25:53.651)
Quit going to Target, go to a museum, you just want to look at things.

Greening Up My Act (25:58.584)
My god, it's so true. It's so true.

Kat (25:59.801)
Yeah. Well, I just want to look at pretty things. yeah. but another thing about like walking outside versus walking on a treadmill is the variety of the terrain is different and that, you know, you can vary your speed differently because you're going up a hill, even if it's just slight, you know, whereas on a treadmill, you have to make that happen and you can have more control over it. But the variety and the surprise...

Greening Up My Act (26:05.784)
That's genius.

Kat (26:28.453)
... is actually what improves your health, right? A lot of the things I said and all these things I was reading is that we can get into ruts and that's when we stop improving our VO2 max or our cardiovascular health and all that stuff is kind of when we start losing the benefits. Like a walk is still be good for you. It won't be as good. I don't know if you can hear my dogs in the background having an argument. They're, they're wrestling. Okay. It's probably cause I'm saying the word walk and we already went for our evening walk.

Greening Up My Act (26:52.728)
Slightly, yeah. Right.

Kat (26:58.237)
But that's a trigger word for them. So maybe they're hearing me say it. So, you know, this, this is, we're already, we're only half an hour in and I'm already basically done with this, but the conclusion is go for a walk. So whether it's in your neighborhood, on a treadmill or in the woods, any walking is going to be better for you than sitting. yeah. And so I came up with a couple of tips. Okay. Ada has tips too.

Greening Up My Act (27:24.196)
Yes, please.

Kat (27:28.315)
Number one, vary your pace. So include bursts of more energy, you know, randomly. If, you know, it's the chorus of the song comes on and you just jog a little or just even walk faster, you know, try that. start slow though, and don't bite off more than you can chew because adding too much spells injury real quick. So don't expect to just start running a nine minute mile from the couch. Go for, just go for a walk to clear your head, right? Um, and let your mind wander. That's my second tip. Leave your technology behind if you can, you know, maybe just listen to music. Always make sure you're safe though. So being on headphones is a way to make yourself a target as a woman, unfortunately. But again, that the ability to have creative thinking is you let your mind wander.

Greening Up My Act (28:10.531)
Yeah.

Greening Up My Act (28:18.368)
Yeah. Yeah.

Kat (28:26.161)
And one of things I always found on runs and walks is if I presented myself with a problem at the beginning, something would happen with the endorphins or something, even my bike rides. If I was having a problem with a person or something at work, I would always come up with a solution at the end. Just somehow, like my brain would just be flooded with chemicals. I was like, this is the answer, you know? Yeah, it's a really good way to problem solve as long as you allow yourself the freedom to do it.

Greening Up My Act (28:46.926)
Whoa, that's so cool. Okay, I love it.

Kat (28:55.675)
I will also say another thing to do is if you work remotely or if you can try to do meeting walks. So I always like, anytime there is a big meeting where it was like a cattle call of, know, however many employees we had that I didn't really have to participate in, but I needed to kind of pay attention to going for a walk on that meeting always helped me instead of, cause I would multitask if I was at my computer, right?

Greening Up My Act (29:25.505)
Yeah.

Kat (29:26.141)
But it's also a good idea if you work in an office, if you have like a one-on-one meeting with your boss or like a small group meeting, go for a walk together. You know, if it's to the coffee shop, wherever it can change how you, know, as long as you don't have to have like a PowerPoint presentation or something up. But if you, you know, if it's just needs to be a talk, go for a walk. It'll be a much more productive meeting. You'll pay better attention. You'll hear each other better and you'll probably problem solve more. So try to incorporate walks into your work if you can.

Greening Up My Act (29:53.592)
Yeah.  Can you do that remotely? 

Kat (29:57.127)
Yeah. well, I remember that time we had the meeting with about podcasting. Yeah. And I was hiking. I was hiking and yeah, I was in Bryce Canyon, Bryce Canyon, Utah. Yep. And I took the call. Yeah. I kept like, was like, look at the crows and the yeah, that was a great, I remember so much more about what it was. The guy who introduced us to how to set up a podcast. And I remember a lot more of that than I would have if.

Greening Up My Act (30:02.464)
I do. My gosh. And you were in the most beautiful place ever. Where were you? Bryce Canyon. God, I felt like I was there. It was so great.

Kat (30:24.531)
You know, it's tied forever in my brain with the beauty of Bryce Canyon. Yeah.

Greening Up My Act (30:27.35)
Yeah, that's awesome. Yeah, it's interesting. I should do that more, because I never really think about it. How did you, so how did you like hold your phone when you were doing that?

Kat (30:43.187)
Well, had, I think I had it in front of me like this, you know, but I also, I'll do this mostly for calls where I don't have to like pay attention to a screen. So just have my headphones in and then put my phone in my pocket and then just walk.

Greening Up My Act (30:47.557)
Okay. So for ones that you don't have to be like on screen, it's good. Okay.

Kat (31:03.237)
Yeah, yeah. You know, or even if you're just in a, I mean, I see a lot of people out on the trails here and they're on calls, like.

Greening Up My Act (31:11.596)
Okay. Yeah, you're right, actually. Huh. That's... That's like, I'm blown. My mind is blown. That's really smart. Because it's kind of like, how the hell do I fit it into my day? But yeah.

Kat (31:20.092)
Yeah.

Kat (31:24.079)
Right. If you have meetings, this is a great way to do it. I mean, it used to like, yeah, I've definitely any town hall meeting or whatever that for a remote job, I just be like, all right, I'm going for a walk unless I'm presenting.

Greening Up My Act (31:38.21)
Yeah.

Kat (31:39.067)
It's just much better, but it helps if you have good cell service in your neighborhood. I don't really, I mean, it's also like, I used to, when I lived in trauma and I didn't really have friends yet, I would pick a friend and call them on my afternoon walk with my dog. And I would have a half hour conversation with someone while I walked, you know? Yeah. Like my mom or my best friend.

Greening Up My Act (31:43.479)
Welfare, yeah.

Kat (32:07.409)
So that's another way to incorporate more walking is just like, and communal time, you know, cause we don't call each other anymore. So.

Greening Up My Act (32:14.56)
Yeah. Right.

Kat (32:18.483)
Um, another thing is going for a walk with a friend is a good idea. Again, that makes the time pass more, but also dogs, as we discussed in our episode earlier this season, dogs are the best walking partners because they will make sure you do it. And they offer you a chance to vary your pace. For instance, today when Ada saw a squirrel and I had to hold on for dear life while she sled dog me down the street. So dogs are really good for that.

Greening Up My Act (32:24.961)
Yeah, totally.

Greening Up My Act (32:33.249)
Yes.

Kat (32:48.979)
Another tip, get the right gear. You don't have to like get all kitted out in your like running gear, but like comfortable shoes. They actually, I didn't include this, but there was a study about running shoes and they're like, there's so much technology and stuff. And the thing they don't talk about is the best running shoes you can get are the ones that are the most comfortable for you. That's what matters. So low drop, high drop, whatever. Whatever doesn't hurt your feet. That's the running or walking shoe for you. I wear this pair of

Greening Up My Act (33:18.19)
That makes so much sense. Okay. Yep.

Kat (33:18.995)
Skechers my sister got me that are just easy to put on. That's what I wear when I go for a walk. Or I have these horrible Tiva sandals that Sean hates, but when it's hot out, they're easy to put on. The dog has actually chewed the toe off of one of them, so it looks really silly. I've got this like bite mark, but they're comfortable, you know, and they're made for, it's just for walking and it's, I don't get plantar fasciitis and shin splints and I'm happy with

Kat (33:45.267)
Rain gear also a good idea so that you'll walk even when it's raining. A sun hat, you know, get the right sunscreen, anything that'll make it comfortable for you. Layers, you know, nice sun shirt. I love sun shirts. I do. I got them when I had cancer. I got a whole bunch. Cause I, I used to run outside and I would go just in a sports bra, you know, when you're cute and you're in your thirties. And then after I got skin cancer, cause I had it on the back of my arm from running too much. Um, so yeah, I have a couple of sunshirts and those are nice. Cause they're like really thin.

Greening Up My Act (33:53.469)
Sun shirt. Do you have any sun shirts?

Kat (34:22.107)
Yeah, they're kind of pricey. 

Greening Up My Act (33:53.469) 
Yeah, I figured. I want to get some, but I haven't yet. That's why I haven't gotten them yet.

Kat (34:22.107) 
Yeah, like Marina Wool is good too.

Greening Up My Act (34:29.226)
Okay, I have one of those. Fascinating. Cotton.

Kat (34:33.178)
It can feel a little warm, but they're more, it's more breathable than. Yeah. Sunshirts are yeah. But anything to cover your skin from the sun is good. Big hat, you know, which is fine for walking, not great for running. I've never found a hat I could run in. Maybe a sun visor, but like my head gets too hot. But with walking I can, I can wear a hat. So big sunglasses. The right headphones.

Greening Up My Act (34:42.295)
Okay.

Kat (35:02.595)
And then yeah, find reasons to make yourself take a walk. Like I said, during meetings is good, but you can walk to a store instead of driving. walk to a bar theoretically. Yeah. Maybe not in your neighborhood. We always, we walk to the bar on the weekends. We take the dogs and we walk to the bar. It's about a mile, mile and a half. That way we don't drive home. and it gets the dogs some exercise and socialization and.

Greening Up My Act (35:12.286)
Mm-hmm. Theoretically, someone, some other people can.

Kat (35:29.531)
It's the dogs, the dogs know when we leave the house and we had one way they're like, we're going to Lazarus and they just drag us there. love it. So, but even just going to explore your city, go walk. used to at one of the offices I worked at downtown here, I would just walk around a park over and over and over just, or even just go walk the steps in the office building when it was too hot. Just go walk. It's really good for you.

Greening Up My Act (35:35.38)
Yeah, that's awesome. So I have a forest bathing story. Not really walking related, but I went on a road trip when I was in.

Kat (36:03.603)
Yes, let's hear it.

Greening Up My Act (36:14.734)
College. Early, early, early college. I was trying to think of it as high school even, but I think it was college. And we went to Michigan. It was with my high school boy, high school slash early college boyfriend. I planned this whole road trip. We each spent like $200, I think. So was like $400 total for like a full week exploring all of Michigan. am, yeah, I was proud of that one because we were both broke.

Kat (36:15.336)
Okay.

Kat (36:27.016)
Nice.

Kat (36:37.437)
That's amazing. Yeah.

Greening Up My Act (36:44.034)
We took his like Toyota Celica, and then drove, you know, I don't know. I think it was probably 12 hours to get to the top of Michigan from Indiana. But anyway, really cool trip, really cool state. I would love to live there, but we were in the upper peninsula and that's like one of the most beautiful places I've ever been in my life. And very Canadian-esque. But, I was sitting, we were by a stream.

Kat (37:07.782)
Yeah.

Greening Up My Act (37:14.026)
And I was sitting, like I noticed this beam of sunlight into the forest floor, basically. And I sat there in it and there was a little caterpillar just like, you know, slowly making its way beside me. And I felt the most peace I have ever felt in my life in that moment. And I just felt like everything was awesome.

Kat (37:22.129)
Mm-hmm. wow.

Kat (37:36.081)
wow.

Greening Up My Act (37:43.906)
And it was so magical. And my boyfriend at the time even was like, I was watching you. And I was like, whoa, you're having a moment. Yeah, like you're having an experience.

Kat (37:51.955)
It's like something came over you, yeah.

Like there's these inexplicable things that happen to us in nature that you don't get in a city. mean, there's other experiences in cities, don't get me wrong, but that, yeah, that feeling of peace and just, yeah, I can think about like in my, when I lived in Chama and my dog would always want to go out in the middle of the night and I didn't have a dog door and it's cause there were elk just laying in the yard.

Greening Up My Act (38:02.221)
Yeah.

Kat (38:25.585)
next to mine and he just wanted to go stare at them. But I would like open the back door and look up and there would be the Milky Way. And that just like that used to be something that our ancestors saw every night to the point that you could like the planet Jupiter would cast a shadow the way the moon does, you know, 200 years ago. And those experiences are like so sacred now.

Greening Up My Act (38:26.315)
Whoa.

Greening Up My Act (38:33.006)
Ugh.

Greening Up My Act (38:46.893)
BWAH!

Kat (38:54.673)
And so rare and so important, you know, we forget how, like we would have bugs on us all the time or around us or like access to them, you know? I mean, people have lived in cities for thousands of years, but even then there, we had much different interactions with nature than we do now. And like walking is a great excuse to just go look at birds. Yeah.

Greening Up My Act (38:55.478)
Yes. Mm-hmm.

Greening Up My Act (39:08.919)
Yes.

Greening Up My Act (39:16.439)
Yeah, totally.

Greening Up My Act (39:23.214)
Yes, totally. Yeah, I've been speaking of bugs and birds. I've been like, I think I mentioned this, but I've been really trying to get Charlie to be okay with bugs. Um, and she's kind of like, she still sometimes gets scared of flying bugs if they're flying around her. Yeah, but ditto. I'm like, what is that in my ear? Yes. Oh gross. Yeah. Um,

Kat (39:32.871)
Yeah.

Kat (39:40.083)
That's scary. Yeah, I am. mean, yeah. When they come at you, that's terrifying. Cockroaches and swings. Yeah.

Greening Up My Act (39:52.098)
But for the most part, I think I've succeeded because she is obsessed with ants and bees and she made a drawing today. my God. I wish I had it. Well, actually we kind of ruined it because we drew on it, but it said my favorite baby animal is blank because it's blank. She filled it in with my favorite baby animal is a spider because it's cute.

Kat (40:07.731)
Ugh.

Kat (40:20.179)
Greening Up My Act (40:20.878)
And then she drew a little spider. I was like, oh my God, I'm so proud. I know.

Kat (40:23.943)
That's amazing. My, one of my good friends from middle school, she volunteers at like the Natural History Museum in LA, I think. But she does like, bug stuff. Like she'll take kids on tours of the bugs and, and she like learned to like taxidermy bugs. Yeah. So sh-

Greening Up My Act (40:37.374)
cool.

Greening Up My Act (40:45.186)
That's so neat.

Greening Up My Act (40:50.446)
Whoa! That's impressive.

Kat (40:52.015)
She's always like, if you see a dead green beetle outside, I've been watching it for a while. She doesn't kill them herself, you know, but if she finds a dead bug that's not decomposed, she will. Yeah. Like I had a tarantula hawk, which I'm sure I've talked about. I had one in my house. No, it flew at my head, but I, the guy I was dating had a bug zapper thing and we fried it outside and I was, I just threw it over the neighbor's fence, but she's like, you should have kept it. I could have made you a necklace out of it.

Greening Up My Act (40:58.731)
huh. She's like, nab it for me.

Greening Up My Act (41:06.87)
Yes! my god. You find it dead? I remember.

Greening Up My Act (41:17.262)
Uh-huh.

Kat (41:21.555)
Cause they're like, they're like, you know, big, they look like the alien. They're like shiny black and then they have these red wings and they're so terrifying. they're so scary.

Greening Up My Act (41:22.19)
So gross.

Greening Up My Act (41:26.925)
Yeah.

I know, I looked them up and I was like, I would literally just croak if that flew up my face.

Kat (41:34.143)
I can't believe I'm still alive after just having it in my house. I mean, you know it's evil when you see it, but they're in my front yard now all the time. my, I'm like, Ada's like, and I'm like, we're not chasing spicy, spicy sky raisins, my friend. No, we are not. It is the most painful sting of any wasp in North America.

Greening Up My Act (41:41.358)
Yes.

Greening Up My Act (41:55.982)
That's what I thought, and they're everywhere? Oh my god.

Kat (41:57.939)
Mmm, not everywhere. They're just around. I see them. I know what they are. they- I'm from Texas. Yeah. Actually New Mexico. They're the, they're the state insect of New Mexico. Yeah. But they- because you know they do? They, they hunt tarantulas.

Greening Up My Act (42:03.626)
Okay, are they from here or are they from elsewhere? Okay, at least there's that. Okay.

Wow, okay.

boy.

Kat (42:21.117)
So they burrow in the ground, they will paralyze the tarantula with their sting, bury it alive, plant their eggs inside of it while it's alive. And then when their larva hatches, they eat the tarantula. I mean, this is literally what, who was it? Who made Ridley Scott base the alien off of? Yeah, they look like the alien.

Greening Up My Act (42:27.463)
huh.

Greening Up My Act (42:32.749)
Ugh.

Greening Up My Act (42:39.308)
That's morbid.

Greening Up My Act (42:45.262)
yeah, you said the alien. Yeah.

Kat (42:48.197)
And he's like, yeah, and the way that they are is kind of like the alien. They like burst out of your chest and like, you know, yeah. So yeah.

Greening Up My Act (42:53.774)
That's insane.

Wow. Well, too bad she didn't get that one for her collection. Or for your collection, I guess. No, that's really cool.

Kat (43:02.355)
I, well, yeah, I don't need it. I, I, yeah, but I mean, there's an end.

Greening Up My Act (43:10.048)
I wish she lived closer and then I would be like, take Charlie on tour.

Kat (43:12.986)
Yeah, I'd buy even if you ever go to LA.

Greening Up My Act (43:15.862)
Yeah. Never know. All right, sweet.

Kat (43:17.139)
I'll hook y'all up.

But that's what I had about walks. So any movement is going to do you good unless your doctor tells you you can't. So follow your doctor's orders. If you're too far gone down the cardiac arrest superhighway, but just a 10 minute walk after dinner so you can go for your fart walk. But yeah.

Greening Up My Act (43:22.923)
Nice.

Greening Up My Act (43:38.112)
Yeah. Yikes.

Greening Up My Act (43:43.498)
There you go. That would be amazing. Sweet!

Kat (43:47.845)
So next week we have local travel. That's on you. what are we doing next week then?

Greening Up My Act (43:52.083)
I changed it.

so I'm doing the joy of thrifting.

Kat (43:59.475)
lovely. Okay. That's even better. I think. Okay. The joy of thrifting. That'll be fun. I'm looking forward to that. Yeah. we're probably, probably due for, I don't know what we're due for. Anyway, follow us on Instagram. We're on Greening Up My Act. Patreon, patreon at greeningupmyact. We have videos up there exclusive to members and we really appreciate our members who support us that way. Thank you. Yeah.

Greening Up My Act (44:01.952)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay, sweet. All right.

Greening Up My Act (44:16.28)
Patreon maybe.

Greening Up My Act (44:26.798)
Yes, means so much. All right. Yes, will do. All right.

Kat (44:28.803)
Thanks for listening and go for a walk.

Alright, bye.

Greening Up My Act (44:48.62)
My buttons aren't showing up.

Kat (44:49.773)
I don't have a way to stop it.

Greening Up My Act (44:55.65)
disappeared. Everything froze. All right, let me try something.

Kat (44:58.402)
no.